War declared?

I’m off out to Smoky-Drinky but wanted to get this one out so I can get opinions.

On the radio today they were discussing whether the Cleggeron Coagulation should impose sanctions on rich Russians living in the UK, like the ones who own football clubs.

I know that UK nationals of German origin were at least closely watched, if not rounded up in WWII. In the USA they rounded up all the Japanese living there and sent them off to camps.

That seems harsh now, but when you’re in a Really Big War you can’t afford to have a subset of the population in which an enemy spy or saboteur could easily hide.

But… we are not at war with Russia. Yet. This seems like the sort of idea that would push such a war a step closer.

My opinion is no, we should not impose any such sanctions. Those Russian nationals living here are not invading Crimea. They have a hell of a lot of money – do we really want all that money and the tax it generates disappearing into Russia, the country we might well soon have to fund a war against?

It’s bad enough as it is – the EU is pushing Putin into a corner where he will have no option but to turn off the gas and oil taps. He’ll just sell more at a slightly lower price to China. Oh, he’ll still get income from gas and oil – while we shiver and eat raw food and go back to the horse and cart.

The government and the EU have cut our military to the bone. We didn’t have enough equipment for them in Afghanistan – what the Hell are they going to use in Russia? Send a gunboat? These days, that’s a skiff with an air pistol aboard. Nuclear submarine loaded with Trident? Oh yes, that’s going to end well. We’d all end up looking like the old ReadyBrek adverts.

It’s all very well the USA shouting at Russia. They aren’t dependent on that oil and gas supply. For us to join in is silly. We have no money and precious little in the way of military hardware. Russia does not have to fire a single shot to take down the EU. Our energy prices are already insane and our generating ability all but wiped out by the Cult of Green. Imagine what will happen when the Russian supply stops.

Picking on rich guys in this country who happen to have come from Russia will make those rich guys leave and take their money with them. It will also serve only to enrage Putin and he’s already shown he doesn’t give a damn what the West thinks. He knows we’re all skint. He knows the EU is a lame duck that talks and talks and makes up stupid laws and has pissed off its own citizens to the point where many now think that being Soviet won’t actually make any difference at all. In some areas, it might even be an improvement.

He doesn’t have to fire anything nuclear either. He can give some to Iran or worse, North Korea and let them pretend they built it themselves, which they will be only too delighted to do. Especially Kim Jong Jingjong or whatever the current mad leader is called over there. You know, the one with the pudding-bowl hair. Who thinks he won’t fire a working nuclear missile if he ever gets one with enough range to hit one of the countries he hates (pretty much all of them, including his own, as far as I can gather)?

It seems to me that we are poking a big and grumpy bear with a pointy stick. When the bear gets up and shows its teeth and claws… all we have is a pointy stick.

Anyway, I’m off to drink whisky before we all end up drinking vodka instead.

All opinions welcome.

 

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35 thoughts on “War declared?

  1. The Ukraine is absolutely no concern of ours. The people living in a place called Crimea voted overwhelmingly to join Russia. I’ve seen no comments or complaints about voter fraud, so all I can consider is that the PEOPLE have spoken. Not the rat-arsed EUSSR who wanted to co-opt the Ukrain in its entirety.
    Democracy, and that means the wishes of the demos, the real, live people living in the place being affected, have been acceded to.
    That is a good thing.

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  2. You’re obviously a Sleeper Communist Infiltrator Mr. Iron… or should I say… Mr. Ironisky! You’ve been exposed and your cover is blown. You’re nothing more than a muscovite lapdog with a red tongue! I’ll see your JingJong hung out to dry for this! You won’t be Putin yer JingJong into any JollyJelly in the future! It’s gonna be 20 years hard labor with a fan, supplying wind energy for Her Majesty’s Navy for you!

    – MJM

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  3. It’s all bollocks, the kind of posturing that drives me mad, especially when I see wee Willy Hague giving it large on the news. We ain’t got shit as you rightly point out leggy, a couple of tug boats at best.

    This is just idiots like Hague talking the big tough guy act to make him feel good about himself. Cameron, Hague, Kerry, Obama, they’re all wankers.

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  4. Lord Montgomery of Alamein, doing a talk at my prep school in, oh, about 1960, remarked among other pleasantries to us boys, the following, or something like it as I recall sort of “Boys, never Attack Russia. Look how it ended for Napoleon and for that recent Austrian chappie who I defeated, and with whom your fathers will all be familiar.”

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    • Hmm. All Russia has to do is hold their positions until winter arrives and wrecks the supply chain for the enemy. Then they walk over and snap the frozen barrels off all the tanks.

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  5. Bit schizo for the Labour party though – support Russia the way their daddies taught them (but it’s won a popular democratic vote), or support EUrope’s socialist dystopia which is their wet dream, though nominally democratic?

    I think the popular democratic vote will swing it… the other way.

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  6. It’s all very well the USA shouting at Russia.

    It’s gone beyond shouting, way beyond.

    Our Esteemed President has unfriended poor Putin on Facebook.
    Russians are no longer eligible for ObamaCare, unless they can walk over the Mexican border.
    Putin has to stand in line at Disneyworld, even if he has a handicapped placard.
    The IRS is auditing Putin (rumor has been spread that Putin leans conservative).

    It is expected that these steps will bring about a quick and complete victory. But if they don’t…well…Mochelle is already in China; she could always swing north and east on her way home.

    Nah. That would be inhumane.

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  7. Historically the Crimea was Russian from 1783 when they nicked it off the Ottomans. Russia threatened the Ottoman Empire so the French and British joined with Johnny Turk and fought the Crimean war. Why Nicky Krushev gave the Crimea to Ukraine is a mystery. The Russians have a good claim. They are still in existence, unlike the republic of Genoa, republic of Venice, Ottoman Empire, Tartar Khanate and Golden Horde who no longer are but who once had the whip hand there. Shows how useless and weak the EU is. Those petty sanctions are really stupid. It’s to do with Russian hegemony in their back yard and we should keep our EU noses out of it.

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    • Khrushchev was Ukrainian himself IIRC. Probably a quid pro quo for some consideration from the local party machine on his way into high office.

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    • From what I’ve been reading, Crimea does not consider itself part of Ukraine anyway. It’s run as a semi-autonomous sub-country.

      If it splits and goes to Russia, that will leave more of Ukraine supporting EU membership. Although they’ll find, if they join, that there’s really no difference any more.

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  8. XX But… we are not at war with Russia. Yet. This seems like the sort of idea that would push such a war a step closer.XX

    Push closer…? Maybe.

    All I can say is, that ALL the Russians I know, and in Berlin, that is a LOT, are some of the best, down to earth, and (except after a bottle or two of Wodka) the most peace loving people I have come accross.

    (Take in to account this comes from someone whos three of four Grand-mothers were around 16 to 20 years old and living here, as the Russians captured Berlin! I do NOT praise the Russians easily!)

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    • All the sanctions are aimed at rich Russians. So it’s not really a sanction, it’s just an excuse for more money-stealing by Western governments.

      Lately there have been crappy attempts to pretend the IRA are active again because they had nobody to scare us with. That’s all stopped now. They have their new bogeyman.

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  9. Why, oh why did the EUSSR continue to enrage Russia after craftily nicking the Baltic states from under their noses? At that time Russia was in a weaker position than now.. Now, the bear can stand on two feet and roar defiance. Because it can, it shall. Monty was correct.

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  10. The problem arose because the EU was whispering, Wormtongue-like into the Ukrainian ear, how loverly it would be if they joined the happy family that is the EU (endorsed heartily by the Obama administration). When the comprehensively gulled Ukrainians started agitating for reform and a place at the EU trough, EU and US started pouring billions into the protester’s coffers. Now they are acting the innocent, throwing up their hands in horror at the fact that Russia is pissed off about what is going on.

    They (EU and US) were basically trying to cut Russia off from Sevastopol and their Black Sea links, and they came unstuck because Putin basically said “Fuck you”, and annexed Crimea.

    Good for him. I’m not a fan of his, but in this instance…

    Putin holds the moral high ground here, and all Haig’s pathetic whining isn’t going to cut any ice with the Russians. EU and US started the whole thing, and it blew up in their faces. I hope they have the sense to back down and swallow their pride.

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  11. To be honest something like this was always going to happen, and quite a lot of people were waiting to see how it would play out when it did occur. The EU, you see, is almost unique in the history of international politics. It is a huge trading bloc which does nominally have its own diplomatic service, but it does not have any military forces that it can call its own. As such, EU diplomacy is lacking a vital back-up which is crucial in situations like this.

    While ever negotations are at the stage of trade negotiations, everything works. The EU can play at traders with the best of ’em. When things deteriorate to the level of “Right, we’ll invade this place and stage a military build-up in as threatening a manner as possible” then that’s the EU scuppered completely, because they cannot do the same. All the EU’s military are somebody else’s and each somebody else has a government that has to answer to that state’s people before the EU does.

    So, pretty much every state is going to tell the EU to go do one before committing troops to the EU’s cause, which will leave the EU diplomatic service standing there looking like a right bunch of nitwits.

    Putin knows this, which is why he’s pushing it now. One good bloody nose for the EU this time round and for a good long time afterwards, it won’t try anything. With a bit of luck Putin might even threaten an EU member, which when the EU lack of response occurs ought to seal the EU’s fate forever.

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